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View Full Version : Man arrested over dispute about which gang colors his kid would wear


Conveyor Belt
04-11-2008, 11:34 AM
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/apr/10/dad-arrested-after-dispute-over-which-gang-right/

Commerce City police were called to a disturbance Saturday at a Hollywood Video on East 64th Street, where a man reportedly was harassing his ex-girlfriend, who was working there.

The man knocked over a computer and a magazine stand and yelled obscenities at her, witnesses said.

He left the store before police arrived.

When officers questioned the woman, they learned that the two had been together for four years and were the parents of a child.

When police asked the woman why the two had separated, she said they have "different ideas about how the baby should be raised," according to a police report.

When officer Daniel Swift asked the woman what she meant by that, she said that the two belong to different street gangs.

"They could not agree on which gang the baby would claim," Swift said.

Joseph Manzanares, 19, was arrested later at his home.

Jesus... can we please, please sterilize these people BEFORE they have kids???

betsy
04-11-2008, 11:36 AM
And we wonder why there are so many juvenile delinquents???

mac
04-11-2008, 11:45 AM
We had a parent conference in which the principal was talking to the parent of a student who was throwing gang signs, making references to gangs, drawing pictures of symbols, etc. Turned out the parent was one of the leader types in the gang.

Not a real productive meeting, as you may guess.

More importantly, what choice does the kid have? I mean if your choice in life is which gang to belong to...

politically incorrect
04-11-2008, 12:06 PM
Take the kid away from these people, please!

I've always been a big Oakland Raiders fan - I know, I know - but I can't wear their hats or jackets now for fear of offending gang-bangers who have adopted the team's logo and colors as their symbols. Something wrong with this situation.

LipsofanAngel
04-11-2008, 01:29 PM
PI- I don't know you, but I'm gonna go out on a limb and make an assumption that it's okay for you to wear your team stuff... I don't think they will have you confused....

LipsofanAngel
04-11-2008, 01:31 PM
And we wonder why there are so many juvenile delinquents???
And often it's not just the parents either... it involves entire communities.

I'm not defending gang activity, but the truth is- that if you want to survive in some areas and cultures, you really don't have a choice but to be affiliated. It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.

OTM
04-11-2008, 01:40 PM
And often it's not just the parents either... it involves entire communities.

I'm not defending gang activity, but the truth is- that if you want to survive in some areas and cultures, you really don't have a choice but to be affiliated. It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.I agree. If you watch Gangland on the History Channel, you'll see that this is true for almost every street gang in America. They had the Crips story last night and if a parent didn't move out of S.Central L.A. when the child was born, he/she was going to be a gangsta.

LipsofanAngel
04-11-2008, 01:44 PM
When does that come on? I always miss shows like that... I need to look and see if the History Channel has any of these type videos available to purchase...

LEGS
04-11-2008, 01:47 PM
I need to look and see if the History Channel has any of these type videos available to purchase...

They do offer most of their programs on DVD. Check their website.

OTM
04-11-2008, 01:48 PM
When does that come on? I always miss shows like that... I need to look and see if the History Channel has any of these type videos available to purchase...It plays as reruns several times a week, but they advertise the DVD's for their shows at Historychannel.com.

LipsofanAngel
04-11-2008, 01:49 PM
great! Now if I can just get my employer to buy them for me :)

LipsofanAngel
04-11-2008, 02:37 PM
Just another though (again, I am not defending or condoning gang affiliation or domestic disputes)....

BUT, I think before we get too judgemental on these folks... think about what we consider "normal"... sororities & fraternities? Athletic teams? I for one refuse to marry a NY Yankee fan for the shear fact that there would be many a trouble in our home!! And, I remember going through sorority rush... I can't tell you how many girls were actually very distraught because they had mom telling them to join one, an aunt fussing at them to join another. I know it seems petty, but there actually is a great deal of familial pressure placed on many a 18 year old ladies moving off to college. The people arguing over the gang? Well, that was their "norm" despite how crazy it seems to those of us who have never had to walk a mile in that culture.

Conveyor Belt
04-11-2008, 03:49 PM
Greek life = Gang life... gotcha.

Gangland is On Demand through Comcast, b/c I've watched it several times through my digital tuner while someone was watching it...

JimmyJam
04-11-2008, 05:15 PM
PI- I don't know you, but I'm gonna go out on a limb and make an assumption that it's okay for you to wear your team stuff... I don't think they will have you confused....


He does bear a slight resemblance to Biggie Smalls......:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1243/1479735310_d09c6d53e2_o.jpg

Yo Yo Yo PI! Whattup Homey?!

TheKing
04-11-2008, 05:33 PM
did anybody watch the movie 'idiocracy'?

if not, you should... even though its a comedy... i think the theory it suggests is spot on..

This story is proof.

LipsofanAngel
04-11-2008, 05:57 PM
Greek life = Gang life... gotcha.

Gangland is On Demand through Comcast, b/c I've watched it several times through my digital tuner while someone was watching it...
No, I didn't say it equaled it :smt105

I was trying to make the point that what is the "norm" is different for different cultures. And I don't think many of us have experienced the culture that these people live in. I also think I made it very clear that I was not approving of gang activity. Just the fact that people have very strong ties and emotional connections to different things.

mac
04-11-2008, 06:04 PM
I don't think it's fair to suggest that gang life is the norm for the entire black community, or that black culture necessarily involves gang culture.

Scarlett O'Hara
04-11-2008, 06:09 PM
Lips, have you ever attended a Ruby Payne workshop?...............She goes into a lot of what you are talking about and it is very interesting...........

Blockhead
04-11-2008, 08:32 PM
Take the kid away from these people, please!

I've always been a big Oakland Raiders fan - I know, I know - but I can't wear their hats or jackets now for fear of offending gang-bangers who have adopted the team's logo and colors as their symbols. Something wrong with this situation.
Don't worry, man. Nobody outside of California associates that gear with those nitwits. They just think "A sorry ass Raider fan. That dude needs to get with a winning team."

Blockhead
04-11-2008, 08:40 PM
No, I didn't say it equaled it :smt105

I was trying to make the point that what is the "norm" is different for different cultures. And I don't think many of us have experienced the culture that these people live in. I also think I made it very clear that I was not approving of gang activity. Just the fact that people have very strong ties and emotional connections to different things.
Not to speak for him, but I think maybe CB was thinking that the peer pressure to join a sorority (a group of girls with which to party and experiment with lesbianism) and the very real threat of physical harm to join a gang (group of people who sell dope, steal, and often maim/kill people) is a hard comparison to make. There certainly are parallels, but not enough to make the comparison viable, IMO.


As for the topic of the thread, I agree. Both parents should have their breeding privileges revoked.

Luvia
04-11-2008, 08:43 PM
BUT, I think before we get too judgemental on these folks... think about what we consider "normal"... sororities & fraternities?


Ugh...I never considered that stuff "normal". :kekeke:

All that stuff made me want to gag in college...but that's just little ol' me and my little ol' opinion.

Blockhead
04-11-2008, 09:03 PM
Not to speak for him, but I think maybe CB was thinking that the peer pressure to join a sorority (a group of girls with which to party and experiment with lesbianism) and the very real threat of physical harm to join a gang (group of people who sell dope, steal, and often maim/kill people) is a hard comparison to make. There certainly are parallels, but not enough to make the comparison viable, IMO.
Lemme backtrack on this a bit.

What I said in the above post is true or larger cities. Down here, it's similar to smoking. You think it's cool. In both cases, you're proven to be a moron.

LipsofanAngel
04-11-2008, 09:32 PM
Mac, I never said anything about blacks. But if you grow up in a life that all you know is gang activity, then yes, THAT IS YOUR NORM. That's what you know. That is what you consider to be a normal lifestyle.

Are sororities and gangs completely different? a big DUH on that one. I was trying to make the point that people have emotional ties to certain things. Why is that so hard to grasp?

And Luvia, you may not have considered it "normal", but obviously a lot of people do or else they wouldn't exist anymore.

LipsofanAngel
04-11-2008, 09:35 PM
Lips, have you ever attended a Ruby Payne workshop?...............She goes into a lot of what you are talking about and it is very interesting...........
Sure haven't... never even heard of her....

Scarlett O'Hara
04-11-2008, 09:46 PM
Lips,found this for you but there are tons of other articles you may be interested in....



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</TD></TR><TR><TD class=titleTableYellow align=middle>WIRE SIDE CHATS</TD></TR><TR><TD bgColor=white>
<!-- START ARTICLE TITLE --><!-- START END TITLE --><!-- START ARTICLE BODY -->http://www.education-world.com/a_issues/chat/images/wire_side_chat.jpgHow Understanding Poverty Can Help Low-Income Children Learn Teachers often come from vastly different social and economic classes than their students, which can lead to culture clashes in the classroom. A book by Dr. Ruby K. Payne helps educators understand low-income students, and discusses ways to improve their learning. Included: Tips for making lessons relevant to students from all social classes.
During her career as an educator, Dr. Ruby K. Payne began to realize that the behavior of some low income students might seem wrong to teachers from middle-income backgrounds, but made sense in the context of students' lives. Payne began to explain her observations to other teachers, and soon was in so much demand, that she found herself writing a book about the topic.
A Framework for Understanding Poverty (http://www.ahaprocess.com/), published by aha! Process, explains to teachers how economic class differences in an educational setting can make teaching and learning challenging. Payne discusses the social cues or "hidden rules" that govern how people think and interact in society -- and the significance of those rules in a classroom. She also speaks at about 200 workshops and seminars a year about understanding the impact of poverty and helping low-income children learn.
Payne talked with Education World about how misperceptions about low-income students and a middle-income frame of reference can hamper the education of students in poverty.

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=5 width=200 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=middle>http://www.education-world.com/a_issues/chat/images/wspayneissuesrubyimage1.jpg</TD></TR><TR><TD align=middle>Dr. Ruby K. Payne </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>Education World: How did you become interested in studying the influence of economic and social classes on how children learn and how teachers respond to them?
Dr. Ruby K. Payne: We had a school with discipline problems when I was the director of staff development for the Goose Creek Consolidated School District in Baytown, Texas. When I explained to the assistant principal the reasons for the behaviors, she asked me to come talk to her staff. I did. The information spread word of mouth. Soon I had individuals outside the district asking for information. I wrote the book to explain it because I could not take all the phone calls. The information came from living among the poor and the wealthy -- in other words, out of life experience and reading.

EW: What are some common misperceptions educators may have about children who come from a low-income background, especially if they are not accustomed to teaching low-income children? <TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=5 width=200 align=left border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=middle>http://www.education-world.com/a_issues/chat/images/wspaynebkissuesimage2.jpg</TD></TR><TR><TD align=middle>"To survive in poverty, you must be very non-verbal, reactive, and sensory-based. To survive in school and work, you must be very verbal, very abstract, and very proactive," says author and educator Dr. Ruby K. Payne. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>Payne: That the students from poverty are not intelligent and that students engage in behaviors that make no sense. To survive in poverty, you must be very non-verbal, reactive, and sensory-based. To survive in school and work, you must be very verbal, very abstract, and very proactive (you must plan.) Abstract means that you can live in a representational world. For example, when a check is written, the understanding is that it represents money that is in the bank as opposed to cash, which is actual money.

EW: What are some strategies teachers can employ to help make lessons more relevant and understandable for children of all social classes?
Payne: We recommend these interventions:
Build relationships of mutual respect with students.
Use direct teach processes. This means that you are very specific in the steps and procedures needed to do something. For example, a recipe has amounts of ingredients but will also tell the steps or order that must be followed to make the item. And in school, often the processes are not identified or written down so they can be consistently followed.
Use mental models. Mental models help translate between the sensory and the abstract worlds. Just as a blueprint translates between the conversation about a house and the actual finished house in the three dimensions, so a mental model translates between abstract constructs and the sensory world.
Teach that there are two sets of rules -- one for school and work, one for outside of school and work.
EW: What do you mean by "hidden rules" within social classes and how should teachers employ knowledge about those rules in their classes? Payne: Hidden rules are unspoken cueing mechanisms individuals use to know whether a person does or does not belong. My book explains them in more detail.
EW: Do you find much resistance to the idea of adapting education to fit the needs of low-income students? If so, why do you think that is? Payne: Some teachers and administrators are very resistant. But overall, there has been much positive support for this information. I think a person always resists what he or she does not understand or believe.
This e-interview with Dr. Ruby K. Payne is part of the Education World Wire Side Chat series. Click here (http://www.education-world.com/a_issues/archives/wire%20side.shtml) to see other articles in the series.
<!--- END ARTICLE BODY --->Article by Ellen R. Delisio
Education World®
Copyright © 2007 Education World
Originally published 10/28/2004; updated 01/15/2007
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LipsofanAngel
04-11-2008, 09:47 PM
I don't see what "this" is! :) But thanks.... almost..... ;)

LipsofanAngel
04-11-2008, 09:49 PM
Just looked up some info on her though. Thanks for mentioning her!

Luvia
04-11-2008, 09:50 PM
And Luvia, you may not have considered it "normal", but obviously a lot of people do or else they wouldn't exist anymore.

Sheesh I was just makin a joke! I mean...I really felt that way, but still... :-D

However, a lot of things exist...but are far from "normal" or at least typical.

LipsofanAngel
04-11-2008, 09:56 PM
Scarlett, my thanks button isn't showing up, but the article is there now. That's actually the one I found when I searched her. Interesting stuff.

Scarlett O'Hara
04-11-2008, 09:58 PM
It's probably because it took me forever to edit out all the junk with the article........I've been to several of her workshops.............She says basically the same things you were saying and I thought you may enjoy reading some of her stuff.

Desert Donkey
04-15-2008, 10:22 AM
And often it's not just the parents either... it involves entire communities.

I'm not defending gang activity, but the truth is- that if you want to survive in some areas and cultures, you really don't have a choice but to be affiliated. It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.

I don't really care about the sociological aspects of gangbangerdom.

I despise gangs and I loathe gangbangers. All of them. I don't feel sorry for them, not one damn' bit. They made the CHOICE to become bangers, and they CHOOSE to remain with their "set" and do the disgusting and senseless things that they do.

This is why I'll never live in any of those cesspools of violence and thievery we call big cities.

I will never knuckle under to some mob of illiterate dirtbags, and I will never allow my children to be led into such a worthless and disgusting lifestyle.

Yeah, I look down on them as cockroaches. Sure do. Maybe I'm wrong for it, and maybe I should go to "sensitivity training" or some other stupid, nanny-state bullsh*t, but I refuse to tolerate the kind of behavior that gangbangers try to force on the rest of us.

I know some people who had affiliations with some gangs at one time, and I make no secret of the fact that I think they were STUPID for doing it. By and large, they are old and wise enough now to agree with me on this. They got out after they started to realize where that sh*t was going, and what it would do to their kids.

Nobody except the most worthless kind of bastard would want to see his children grow up to be gangbangers.